Aeroplan SE Desk not upgrading
January 5th, 2009What gives?
I still have a problem when TA's are getting paid and not performing the service that you expect. Take it up with your TA not AC. Maybe they should pay AC their commission for dealing with you instead of them.
My opinion hasn't changed. Yeah, it sucks that you have to use a TA for flights or are mandated but too bad. Maybe corporate policy needs to be changed then.
And Lornag, I'm sorry if you are booking through a mom and pop shop. This is clearly your choice. They obviously cannot provide the level of service a sophisticated traveller needs so why are you using them. They are getting the commission and you are using AC people. Maybe if a TA is a requirement you need to switch to one of the larger one's that has 24 hour service.
I have to agree with the general concept. In this era of relatively far-lower airfares and greater booking opportunities, if you have to, or choose to, use a specific agency and they are ill-equipped or just don't care to service their sale all the way through, I think the complaint is with that agency. If your work requires you to use a specific agency, tell your office travel desk and let them know that the specific agency is unwilling/unable to work with your UG (or whatever) request. Not addressing it correctly and choosing to bypass the vendor will not solve the problem.
Gimme a break. Ask your TA where your commission money is going. :rolleyes: Or do you even care. On the one hand many of you are happy to be paying for a service that you are getting very little in return but expect the world from AC all the time. Maybe those who book through TA's should pay an additional service charge for the service of someone touching their itinerary much the same as a TA will do. I don't understand why you expect any difference. I would persume that you would also spend a lot of money purchasing tickets through the TA and be a preferred customer with them. Why not expect better service from them???????
I may also be mistaken but I thought that once you started your itinerary you could use the SE desk to upgrade. I can't confirm but thought that was in a post in the other thread.
I think you maybe a TA inside Bell which makes it sad that you cannot negotiate better deals for BCE with 6000 travellers.
BTW in a post above you tried to download your TA responsibilities for those 6K travellers to AC......do you think they should pick up additional cost on top of the fees you already make from them or the corporate discounts you get.
No your answer is not correct. If it was, only AC would be able to change return segments on a roundtrip journey.
No I don't work for BCE nor do I work on the account... BCE would actually hire a travel manager to look at corp discounts and ticketing discounts with AC and other carriers. He or she would work in conjunction with a account manager at a large Travel Agency
Yes, large firms do pay extra for 24 hour service from an emergency line.... I do not expect you to understand how pricing works on mega million dollar accounts. Long term AC's move will actually just get pushed down the line in terms of actual costs. Depends how many individual travellers will pick up the line to handle their upgrades beyond the usual 8am - 6pm window.
The reason I use a travel agent is that for trips to Asia, the consolidator fares are significantly lower that the AC fares for the same fare classes.
No, question as we've hashed this out before but I certainly was not convinced. I use a mom and pop operator for many of my itineraries, which often are complicated and use AC plus non-star alliance airlines from time to time. For all sorts of business and personal reasons, I need to get comparative pricing WITH FARE CLASSES, in order to make this decision and neither air canada.com nor, air canada by phone can technically or objectively offer me that.
Mom and Pop operators are a middle ground in terms of cost and offer me an objective overview of my choices.
Lorna
p.s. Not a question, but thanks for the opportunity to vent!
I agree, I do most of my hotel/air/car bookings on my own... but I can't help but utilize some of those great consolidator fares.. just too good to pass up compared to what I can find online.
Lorna
Doing the job at home. ^
Lorna
And you can say, boo hoo, poor self employed, little guy...tough...but we are out there and this kind of policy just pisses me off. (It also would have been nice if we were given some lead time on this notification)
Lorna
Somewhat off topic, but what, if any, are the benefits of using a TA if you're a self-employed individual? Why not just book your flights directly?
Ask me after a few pops and I will probably agree with you. :D
Won't change my dislike for TA's though.
Don't you know, those of us who live in YVR usually stay here for most of the summer?
Lorna
I think it is the weather. I will be enjoying a few wobblies on my back deck this evening. I have to keep my tolerance up for my visit to the office the middle of August. If anyone is going to be in YVR.
Ask me after a few pops and I will probably agree with you. :D
Won't change my dislike for TA's though.
Off-topic, but does this mean that the upgrade windows will be strictly adhered to? For example, you can currently convince an agent to upgrade you 4 or 7 days before your flight if it's midnight somewhere in Canada, even though it may not be in your time zone. Will the electronic upgrade process force you to wait until it's midnight in your time zone?
I think you're in first place for the generalizing prize of the year when you make comments like:
Yes, I appreciate your points, but I still can't shake my feeling that traditional TAs for individuals are a doomed breed, destined to be completely replaced by the web
Either way, I was poking fun at the idea of all these people in a start up company running around looking for air and hotel deals all day instead of starting up the company. If anything, a young company with no buying power, would benefit from the buying power of a good corporate agency with Consortia hotel deals and consolidated airfares. Not to mention the ability to hold and monitor seat availability and fares.
The reason I use a travel agent is that for trips to Asia, the consolidator fares are significantly lower that the AC fares for the same fare classes.
BCE and its affiliates run approx 6,000 travel profiles.... lets say each one runs up an emergency call once a year for an upgrade. Do the math and tell me if it is still BS. Mind you their emergency rate isn't $20, but if you like I can give you the address to send your cheque to BCE the make sure poor old AC doesn't have to staff their call centres with people to answer calls from their top tier customers.
Yes, it doesn't matter where you bought your ticket from. :)
Why doesn't AC think a little and make this type of a change after they give us the tools to deal with the upgrade on our own like the AA option. All you have done AC is once again upset those that are your frequent flyers. I hold the SE equivalent level on two other airlines, that is a bunch of money AC could have had and would have had if they just took better care of this passenger. :mad:
And, yes, I am also annoyed. :mad:
Lorna
Gee, what's all the fuss?
I wake up in the morning and there's an e-mail for me advising of my U/G or I log onto the Website and look at my itineraries and there it is - albeit I don't get U/G all the time but I buy low-end tickets. It must be magic or computers....
WAIT!! I'm talking about CO domestic flights where I get on a space available basis unlimited U/G ^ :cool: and not AC :td: !
However for my overseas travel I typically utilize a travel agent with access to consolidator fares. The savings are always substantial and they earn their fee by consulting on complicated itineraries and finding the best value. They also offer to process upgrades for me every time.
However, I consider my upgrades to be a benefit of my frequent flyer relationship with Air Canada. I likewise consider the process of confirming these upgrades to be part of this relationship.
I think this policy is just another reduction in benefits in Air Canada's frequent flyer program.
I don't understand why, since this should not be a costly service to provide. I would imagine a message while on hold, or a quick comment from the agent, letting their valued frequent flyer know that they can also process upgrades through their travel agent would be appropriate.
I just got off the phone with a United reservations agent who was pleased to move me to Economy Plus for my upcoming international itinerary. I booked with a TA but the United agent helped me without any problems. She even worked with her supervisor to open up some seats for me.
Don't get me wrong, I support Air Canada. However my blind love has garnered mixed results, and I'm starting to temper my devotion with some business for others. I hope the trend reverses because AC out of Toronto is most convenient and I expect to be in SE territory for the next 15 years or so.
EliteTrotter
Well in my case I am booking with internal travel dept., and the point in having the TA do the upgrade is one of the upgrade window for me. They obviously are not able to call at 12:01 AM, so I have to wait till my TA gets in at 9AM and then I have to hope they make the change right away and not when they get to it. :mad: I also have a 24 hour emergency number that could be used, but that costs my company an extra fee when I call and the nature of the call is registered so the head of the travel department will question me on the use of this for an upgrade.
Offering me the ability to upgrade with the SE desk is just good customer service. Creating these restrictive policies that really do little to enhance AC's image with those of us who have been loyal to AC for the past couple of years is just dumb. Again if this is the direction AC wants to move in, fine, but don't do it before you provide the ability to make this easy for your customers by using a web based program. Is AC really saving much here, or is this another decision by someone sitting in a cube in Montreal who really hasn't thought about the impact and more importantly how it is impacting the people who are their frequent flyers. :confused:
In my case I fly J international, and I do a great deal of it. My travel policy is economy to and from the US. I got tired of the AC issues and switched over to AA, and with my international travel quickly achieved their SE equivalent on flights that AC could have provided to me to Europe and Asia. As a result I get 100% upgrades on all my US flights and no hassle. AC now gets very little of my travel to the US and hardly anything over the water. I am still SE and will continue to be thanks to *A, and my need to get all those AP points out of my account, which my wife enjoys spending for me on flights to join me and not on toasters.
..."logistical problems"....
is that another way to say that the present IT system cannot support such an initiative? :)
Sure it does; you mentioned 6,000 BCE employees with travel accounts and I thought it important to let people know how badly managed the company is since you like to think AC is bad
If a TA builds a PNR on ac.com it lives in RESIII. You are telling me AC doesn't control it?
As best I know, yes....if done by a TA
AA, UA, BA, CO, DL, NW, AF, KL, LX all seem to be able to access and work PNRs on behalf of TAs and their mutual clients. Heck AF did a ticket exchange for me when their CDG-YUL flight was delayed by 6 hours. These airlines understand that TAs work in partnership with airlines to service their mutual clients. Its not a street fight or a game of favorities. It is suppose to be a partnership to service mutual clients
Its a well know fact that AC's systems need updating and much more band width and that is coming.
Some bean counter on at 5100 DeMaisonneuve doesn't get that.
Is he the guy they hired from BCE and their billing team?
Why in the world would you wait until "post" time to call your TA? Isn't that something you would arrange when setting up the itinerary? If your TA needs you to call and remind him/her of the UG booking window, I'd be complaining to the agent's boss or my corporate desk about the lack of follow-through. I would expect the TA to contact the airline in timely fashion and email/call the details to your chosen point-of-contact.
Funny thing. I just spoke to my TA about this stupid thing. He is going to power up his computer on Sunday night at 9 p.m. at home to do the upgrade. Nice guy.
Lorna
I take it you are SE ,have upgradeable fare and coupon and are at 7 day window.
Gimme a break. Ask your TA where your commission money is going. :rolleyes: Or do you even care. On the one hand many of you are happy to be paying for a service that you are getting very little in return but expect the world from AC all the time. Maybe those who book through TA's should pay an additional service charge for the service of someone touching their itinerary much the same as a TA will do. I don't understand why you expect any difference. I would persume that you would also spend a lot of money purchasing tickets through the TA and be a preferred customer with them. Why not expect better service from them???????
I may also be mistaken but I thought that once you started your itinerary you could use the SE desk to upgrade. I can't confirm but thought that was in a post in the other thread.
I don't have a choice of TA. It's what my company tells me to use or I can't expense the flight. In addition, our TA charges a hefty after hours fee on top of the normal service fee if we use them after normal business hours. My company will not reimburse me for these after hours calls unless it's a valid business reasons... and we all know "because I wanted to upgrade" isn't going to cut it... so I guess I'm just SOL in situations where it's midnight and "I1".
In my view the SE desk is there to provide the best possible service to AC's top clients. That is what they are there for.
Upgrading is a benefit of the program and the SE desk should be happy to help out. It is all about great customer service for your top clients. Period. This is not in my view some outlandish request...........
Disgraceful!
Makes me happy that I am not SE anymore.
MCM.
(where is Parnel.....)
You got it. SOL. Maybe you need to take it up with the person who negotiates the contracts with your TA to get a better deal if you guys are buying a lot of travel and are not getting the level of service that you want.
Do you feel your company is getting great service for the fees they are paying your TA?
As a self-employed, small business person, I make 90% of my bookings directly online with travel suppliers, hotel or airline. It is only on certain complicated bookings that I will work through a TA who will earn their $50 or whatever service fee. And I do not begrudge paying the fee if they're doing their job properly.
BTW, on most NAmerican flights, I don't believe TAs get a commission any longer from the airlines. They may get volume commissions, but no longer the old style commission per flight booked. This was a major dispute between them and the airlines when the latter decided to trim back costs by reducing and then eliminating commissions on all but overseas flights. That's when TAs started charging a service fee, which these days is about $50 a booking.
The idea is that a good TA provides service to save you time and energy [i.e. reconfirm, confirm upgrades for elites, handle changes, notify you of sked changes, etc.] and thus earns the money you pay. TAs also have access to fares not generally available online from the airlines themselves, like consolidator fares. By offering hundreds of dollars of savings on international flights, they pay for themselves. [But of course, remember, in terms of service you generally get what you pay for, as someone above noted.]
Gee, what's all the fuss?
I wake up in the morning and there's an e-mail for me advising of my U/G or I log onto the Website and look at my itineraries and there it is - albeit I don't get U/G all the time but I buy low-end tickets. It must be magic or computers....
WAIT!! I'm talking about CO domestic flights where I get on a space available basis unlimited U/G ^ :cool: and not AC :td: !
Yeah yeah we know we know...
It is expected upgrades will be going electronic next year, both eliminating the paper certificates, and the need to call in. Like AA, one will likely be able to just put the request in at time of booking and it will be automatically processed at your upgrade window.
2) Consolidator fares that are not offered on the web;
3) TA may know some tricks that no website can offer;
4) TA and/or consolidator rules may have overriding benefits vs. a carrier's website booking;
5) and the list goes on...
5) comparative international fares which need fare class information (hopefully this will be resolved soon)
Yes indeed ... ;)
Tickets for myself and companion for this trip booked through our usual YQB TA; not an issue raised by SE line CSA...... ^
Happy Bastille Day from Dijon ! Belly full of wine so have to go to bed now before annoying accordion music and cheap home-made fireworks drifting over from neighbouring village make me put my pants back on and go out for another drink.... (please forgive me, I know not what I say :o Cursed drink.... :eek: )
And I am happy to do so also when the web is as robust as the TA.
Lorna
Exactly. This is completely ridiculous.
is that another way to say that the present IT system cannot support such an initiative? :)
No it has more to do with the use of U/G certs;they want to cut down the fraud but not the transferablity of the certs and right now its logistically impractical. Their IT system does need work which it is getting but priorities are the booking engine and other internal needs.
They are currently spending many millions on system growth.
I am not sure I understand the discussion 100% ... by my corporate travel agent has many times told me that if I upgrade with AC directly then no longer have direct access to the reservation and would not see changes in sched etc (not sure if this is what you meant) ... and recently I cancelled an upgraded flight and they (my TA) had to go through some extra steps to get back the reservation from AC to cancel it for me...
FWIW ...
I would also like to do this, but I doubt we travel to the same places.
Lorna
One company I work with actually blocked expedia and travelocity from the firewall to prevent staff from wasting time looking at airfares for their flights. They want people working, not shopping around to save 20$ on an airline ticket.
In addition, many companies use TA's for more reasons than you just stated.
1) To track employee spendings and bookings for expense and fraud detection purposes;
2) To have more bargaining powers for bulk rate discounts with either an airline or the travel agency;
3) A way to track the whereabouts of an employee while at a client, in case of emergency situations (this is what our company does... if the company can't locate a practitioner, they will look to the TA to see where the last trip was and perhaps see if the person is staying at a particular hotel, etc.);
4) Not all consolidators have an online presence;
5) and the list goes on...
Although I am still wary of TAs, I do think they are useful.
Well if you refuse to understand the answers given then it is over.........just checked with someone at Ac and was told they would own the PNR if they do an U/G on a TA booked flt. Other airlines use other systems and the Ac person was sure AC would get around to that with all the systems changes coming but since there is such a minsicule demand for that it will not get immediate priority or study. Lets face it most of us, if not almost all of us, normally only book our U/G's during normal hours.
The debate is over because either you don't like the facts or can't stand it when your own company is much worse at their business proactices then the one you're compaining about ;)
If I had a choice, I would normally agree with you, but here I have no choice at all so in a way, I am being penalized even though I didn't ask for it.
You are absolutely right. You are being penalized because you have to use a TA. I am not because I don't. My wife goes through the same issue as she is mandated to purchase through AMEX. You work for a company you have to live by their rules. Unless I am misunderstanding, I am not sure how you can be getting great service from your TA if you are calling the SE line to make any changes to your seat assignments or upgrading. Maybe I misunderstood your answer.
I'm glad a bought the beers in YVR, I hope they soothe a little of the pain you guys are feeling because of this change. ;)
I still have a problem when TA's are getting paid and not performing the service that you expect. Take it up with your TA not AC. Maybe they should pay AC their commission for dealing with you instead of them.
My opinion hasn't changed. Yeah, it sucks that you have to use a TA for flights or are mandated but too bad. Maybe corporate policy needs to be changed then.
Chris, some of us don't work for companies who absorb all these costs, some of us are self employed. If I have to pay over $100 dollars to book a ticket through a Large TA and possibly more to call the "emergency" line for weekend upgrades, this cuts into my profits. Futher, although I did use Amex for a long time, I moved from them, when I just wasn't getting the response time I needed and I was getting nickled and dimed to death.
And you can say, boo hoo, poor self employed, little guy...tough...but we are out there and this kind of policy just pisses me off. (It also would have been nice if we were given some lead time on this notification)
Lorna
I will certainly, whole heartedly agree with you that there should have been some level of communication from AC. However, this is one areas where they tend to fail on every account. I don't know too many people who will argue that point.
However, I also realize that you want a specific service and there is a cost to that service. Quite frankly my wife has to use AMex and their service is horrible, but they or any other TA are the one's getting the commission but not providing the service. This is my problem with the whole deal. I sympathize with you that you want the cheapest fees but I also have a hard time with the fact that someone is getting paid for not going anything and why should this service fall back to the airline, or maybe the airline should cut their commissions further in these instances. (this should be popular amongst the TA crows :D )
Okay Chris
I'm not sure who decided this was a service as part of the TA package. Whatever...all I know is that it adds to my cost of doing business with AC. As I am a super elite this year, the benefits still outweigh the costs, but as these things just peck and peck away...
Lorna
Yes, it doesn't matter where you bought your ticket from. :)
Why doesn't AC think a little and make this type of a change after they give us the tools to deal with the upgrade on our own like the AA option. All you have done AC is once again upset those that are your frequent flyers. I hold the SE equivalent level on two other airlines, that is a bunch of money AC could have had and would have had if they just took better care of this passenger. :mad:
One company I work with actually blocked expedia and travelocity from the firewall to prevent staff from wasting time looking at airfares for their flights. They want people working, not shopping around to save 20$ on an airline ticket.
I find the time explaining my itn to a travel agent (i.e when I need to arrive, distance to client, when I need to leave - considering travel time, traffic etc), waiting for feedback, the requisite telephone tag etc to take far more time than booking myself. Your argument just doesn't 'fly' (disclaimer -- at least in my situation, and excluding complicated itn that require TA assistance).
PJB
Tickets for myself and companion for this trip booked through our usual YQB TA; not an issue raised by SE line CSA...... ^
Happy Bastille Day from Dijon ! Belly full of wine so have to go to bed now before annoying accordion music and cheap home-made fireworks drifting over from neighbouring village make me put my pants back on and go out for another drink.... (please forgive me, I know not what I say :o Cursed drink.... :eek: )
You bring up a good point. Return flts are already in AC control so can be Handled by them
Flts booked by TA's are in TA control until the first BP of the ITN. is issued. IMO if you will need an U/G I suggest the TA be instructed to turn over the file to AC if they cannot provide the service in a timely manner.
As for those of you whose companies will not pay for the "emergency" service I say BS........you mostly travel on your own time and get U/G perks based on that travel which reduces the cost of flying you places,so $20 to use the TA for an U/G is really peanuts and IMO cheap crap by the TA's.
Some dumb bean counter dreams up these rules although I would suspect that if working for a major corp there is enough Expense report "room" to slip in that cost if the company won't pay the TA directly.
As for Lorna I would say the mom and pop guy should transfer your file to AC so you can ge tthe U/G at the opening "bell" for that flt.
As Several of us have said AC DOES NOT CONTROL THE FILE UNTIL YOUR FIRST BP IS ISSUED . Is that too hard to understand?
Your first point has nothing to do with travel... and your second point is, as you like to say, BS. If this was the case why were upgrades handled by AC from day one??????
If a TA builds a PNR on ac.com it lives in RESIII. You are telling me AC doesn't control it?
AA, UA, BA, CO, DL, NW, AF, KL, LX all seem to be able to access and work PNRs on behalf of TAs and their mutual clients. Heck AF did a ticket exchange for me when their CDG-YUL flight was delayed by 6 hours. These airlines understand that TAs work in partnership with airlines to service their mutual clients. Its not a street fight or a game of favorities. It is suppose to be a partnership to service mutual clients. Some bean counter on at 5100 DeMaisonneuve doesn't get that. :td: :td:
Upgrading must be done by TA prior to departure of the first segment is purely referring to CRS bookings. Once AC touches the file, they will take over it and agencies won't be able to see things such as sked change.
Thanks for weighing in Andrew.
I spoke with my TA on this. They usually book through the ADO website for Domestic and most of US travel. Where they use a CSR is when booking on a codeshare, operated by other than AC or when an itinerary includes something that doesn't show up on the ADO website, such as my segment from FRA to Turin and they need a throughfare, YVR TO TURIN.
Crazy thing is I usually book through the website or AC for Domestic and my US travel. So, I don't need the TA. It's most of the international stuff that I need the TA. And for that AC is penalizing me 'cos their own system doesn't handle these bookings. It's okay to say, go do stuff on the website, WHICH I DO WHEN AT ALL POSSIBLE, but if it's not robust enough, I'm the one SOL.
Lorna
I think we are dealing with a minority of people and those of us on FT are not normal as most of us know. And since I never use a TA, It really doesn't affect me since I can use the provider I choose to purchase through.
The reason I use a travel agent is that for trips to Asia, the consolidator fares are significantly lower that the AC fares for the same fare classes.
Yes, and my experience from my posts in the "Consolidator Fares" thread backs this up... I will be using a TA and am worried about this since the YVR ICN flights are showing "I2" at the max.
Well first of all let me congratulate Ma bell for their excellent work on the new billing systems last year and the billions they lost in misguided acquisitions in previous years.
As Several of us have said AC DOES NOT CONTROL THE FILE UNTIL YOUR FIRST BP IS ISSUED . Is that too hard to understand?
The TA sells the ticket and wants to keep control of the file as long as possible bcause that's the service they offer.
Its not likely that in any other agency relationship the end supplier would take over the account directly from the middle man without his permission.........so why should AC be tarred with doing that.
AC owns segments (or if you pref legs) of PNRs once the eticket coupon has been lifted for actual flight. Generally speak, If AC touches a file a TA can touch it too. As for web bookings being owned by a TA, this is also wrong, the booking lives in RESIII, a TA would HAVE to call AC to process the upgrade, they cannot look at it in the GDS.A PNR that's made on the travel agent ADO website CAN BE upgraded by AC even before departure of the first segment; it doesn't have to be done by the travel agent so that's not even an issue. The customer can call AC reservations to request the UG.
Upgrading must be done by TA prior to departure of the first segment is purely referring to CRS bookings. Once AC touches the file, they will take over it and agencies won't be able to see things such as sked change.
I'm glad a bought the beers in YVR, I hope they soothe a little of the pain you guys are feeling because of this change. ;)
We only want to use the SE desk for a quick upgrade... it's not like we're asking them to override what the TA did and start making changes and stuff... just a simple upgrade is all we ask :) So I am perfectly ok with using the TA, even for upgrades, but at times where I have a gun put to my head and have no choice a quick call to the SE desk for the quick and easy upgrade wouldn't hurt either...
Another round of beer is in the calling :D
I agree that this is good service from your TA and you are getting what you are paying for. ^ Someone buy that guy a beer! :D
Andrew answered your Question so you can see that AC is aware..which again is better service than I've received from Ma Bell recently.
My point being that calling the other guy "out" when their own house is pretty damn screwy gives one pause on credibility.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=443902
The concensus from the above thread is still wishy-washy, but from the experience of the OP, it sounds like it's possible to miss an upgrade if your mom & pop TA shop is closed at midnight and it's currently showing "I1". Call them the next business morning to upgrade and lo & behold it's "I0".
AC, this one's for you in terms of this topic --> :td: :td: :td:
I still like AC though :)
Overall, this is a silly move on the part of AC. Two steps forward, three steps back.
Is it OK for AC to implement cost-savings corporate policies in the manner of, say, the company where you work?
I think you are generalizing everyone's personal situations on how they book flights... ask Lornag, for example... her itineraries are too complicated to be booked online so she requires a TA... others have different scenarios...
Flts booked by TA's are in TA control until the first BP of the ITN. is issued.
So if I book two one way tickets, one outbound, one return, this implies that the TA will control both, as they are two seperate itineraries?
1) Complex itineraries;
2) Consolidator fares that are not offered on the web;
3) TA may know some tricks that no website can offer;
4) TA and/or consolidator rules may have overriding benefits vs. a carrier's website booking;
5) and the list goes on...
As I mentioned before, I cannot always book my flights directly as I need to know the options for fare classes, and compex itineraries with some non *A destinations which neither Air Canada, nor travelocity can offer me. When I have a relatively simple itinerary, I do book directly using AC. When these booking engines either online or by phone can offer me objective choices by fare class, I'm happy to book using the internet.
Lorna
It is expected upgrades will be going electronic next year, both eliminating the paper certificates, and the need to call in. Like AA, one will likely be able to just put the request in at time of booking and it will be automatically processed at your upgrade window.
It is not expected that upgrades will be electronic next year. I have been specifically told by those in charge that will not happen because there are too many logistical problems with "E" U/G's.
And you can say, boo hoo, poor self employed, little guy...tough...but we are out there and this kind of policy just pisses me off. (It also would have been nice if we were given some lead time on this notification)
Lorna
Lorna,
I will certainly, whole heartedly agree with you that there should have been some level of communication from AC. However, this is one areas where they tend to fail on every account. I don't know too many people who will argue that point.
However, I also realize that you want a specific service and there is a cost to that service. Quite frankly my wife has to use AMex and their service is horrible, but they or any other TA are the one's getting the commission but not providing the service. This is my problem with the whole deal. I sympathize with you that you want the cheapest fees but I also have a hard time with the fact that someone is getting paid for not going anything and why should this service fall back to the airline, or maybe the airline should cut their commissions further in these instances. (this should be popular amongst the TA crows :D )
Lorna
I guess stinger will agree here that this is good service ^
You would be correct sir! Any reason why you are not booking a return ticket? I hope you are getting good service from your TA since you will probably pay for their service twice since it would be two separate itineraries. :p
Sounds like a great system for upgrading to register your upgrade at time of booking so you don't have to go in at midnight the night before the window opens. However, is this the case with AA when tickets are purchased through a TA as in the OP's case?
I would like to see this option with AC since I purchase all of my tickets myself on their site.
One company I work with actually blocked expedia and travelocity from the firewall to prevent staff from wasting time looking at airfares for their flights. They want people working, not shopping around to save 20$ on an airline ticket.
Right, I need to justify the five minutes it takes me to book a plane ticket to you.
This was discussed at length in another thread recently ... but I cannot locate it and did not get search to work at all? :(
Folks appear to have had varied results -- calling in a 2nd time seems to often help.
Oh and BTW, most large companies aren't interested in adding "upgrades" to the corporate travel policy. Thus the use of after hour lines or asking your corp Amex TA to handle it for you is usually against corporate travel policy.
Overall, this is a silly move on the part of AC. Two steps forward, three steps back.
Exactly. I now have to call my company TA to call AC to do it. It is one more step. That is not providing service at all.
Excuse me, but did you not read my post? We've been told at several AC gatherings that as part of the enhancements to their booking site, this will be happening. Parnel has posted this in threads about upgrade certs as it is clear that AC is moving to electronic u/gs as used by UA and AA. We've seen significant enhancement to AC's booking site, particularly with the new fares and enhanced ability to book by fare class. These steps are introduced incrementally, and the next step is moving overseas fares into the same categorization as we have for domestic [on many AC non-stop routes].
Those are priorities before the facility to process online upgrades. I agree AA has a very good system, and given what we've seen from AC in recent months, theirs should give us a similar capability, hopefully by the next benefit year. [Though the downside may well be our ability to lend or give away u/gs we personally cannot use.]
How am I generalizing by simply commenting on my own personal experience? As I said in my original post, I understand that my travel requirements are probably less complex than those of others here, and that's why I see no need or value in a TA. And what does this have to do with my response to another poster, who was actually making broad generalizations about people who book themselves and don't use TAs?
2) Consolidator fares that are not offered on the web;
3) TA may know some tricks that no website can offer;
4) TA and/or consolidator rules may have overriding benefits vs. a carrier's website booking;
5) and the list goes on...
Yes, I appreciate your points, but I still can't shake my feeling that traditional TAs for individuals are a doomed breed, destined to be completely replaced by the web. My travel needs are likely simple relative to others, and the company I do most of my work for is in start-up mode and hasn't gotten around to having any centralized travel booking. I'm generally happy to do all of my own hotel, airline and rental car bookings.
Since when was this "enhancement" made to RESIII? Previously, as I have mentioned, while a GDS booking would not change to C / I class once upgraded items like schd changes would still come across in the PNR. The original segment and booking class is still live in the GDS.
Furthermore, if AC cannot upgrade the first segment for schd change and PNR ownership reasons, why would they upgrade a 3 or 4 or 5th segment? And no Parnel, its not because AC owns a PNR after the first BP has been printed.
Is this one of those "it doesn't matter if it's stupid, it's company policy" things?
Maybe the mom and pop shop charges a much lower service fee? I guess you are saying that it's a YGWYPF type thing?
An earlier poster has this right ... why can AC not wait until after the roll out of the automated system to impose this punitive rule on their BEST CUSTOMERS! Come to think of it why are they after their best customers in the first place?
You're excused. :D I have and that is why I made the point of saying AC should not make the change to the use of the SE desk till AFTER they get the electronic u/gs in place. Doing it now has only upset their customers.
I still have a problem when TA's are getting paid and not performing the service that you expect. Take it up with your TA not AC. Maybe they should pay AC their commission for dealing with you instead of them.
My opinion hasn't changed. Yeah, it sucks that you have to use a TA for flights or are mandated but too bad. Maybe corporate policy needs to be changed then.
And Lornag, I'm sorry if you are booking through a mom and pop shop. This is clearly your choice. They obviously cannot provide the level of service a sophisticated traveller needs so why are you using them. They are getting the commission and you are using AC people. Maybe if a TA is a requirement you need to switch to one of the larger one's that has 24 hour service.
AC really needs to get moving on updating the IT stuff.
Yes I do.
If I had a choice, I would normally agree with you, but here I have no choice at all so in a way, I am being penalized even though I didn't ask for it.
AC owns segments (or if you pref legs) of PNRs once the eticket coupon has been lifted for actual flight. Generally speak, If AC touches a file a TA can touch it too. As for web bookings being owned by a TA, this is also wrong, the booking lives in RESIII, a TA would HAVE to call AC to process the upgrade, they cannot look at it in the GDS.
Your refusal to believe that someone at AC is giving out wrong info ends my debate with you.
Did you consider for a moment that your job at xyz startup company is to work on starting up the company and getting products to market and not looking to see if priceline has a better deal than travelocity? :rolleyes:
One company I work with actually blocked expedia and travelocity from the firewall to prevent staff from wasting time looking at airfares for their flights. They want people working, not shopping around to save 20$ on an airline ticket.
OK, I'm confused. Is the point that AC cannot process upgrades for you if you used a TA? I know it can, because when I speak at conferences the conference folks book the tickets for me, and I routinely upgrade them by calling the teeny tiny reservations number on the back of my card. I thought people were arguing that AC shouldn't have to process them because TA's should be earning their keep or some such.
I have a hard enough time trying to teach US-based conference TA's that I want an Air Canada ticket on an Air Canada plane, not a United ticket. I can't imagine getting them to do my upgrade. And I doubt the organizers budgeted for the TA to do so, either. Yet in most cases I cannot be reimbursed for tickets I buy myself: my only choice is to let them buy the tickets according to their own policies. If this means no more upgrades for me, I want to know, because I will push at the time of accepting the gig to settle things like must I use your TA and will your TA help me with upgrades.
Furthermore, if AC cannot upgrade the first segment for schd change and PNR ownership reasons, why would they upgrade a 3 or 4 or 5th segment? And no Parnel, its not because AC owns a PNR after the first BP has been printed.
My answer was correct.
I think you maybe a TA inside Bell which makes it sad that you cannot negotiate better deals for BCE with 6000 travellers.
BTW in a post above you tried to download your TA responsibilities for those 6K travellers to AC......do you think they should pick up additional cost on top of the fees you already make from them or the corporate discounts you get.
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